This led in turn to the Tories recent announcement that they'd love to dump the European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) because - let's face it - Europe is a meddling pest etc. This conversation also then went on to include Tory interests into having secret courts in the name of "national security".
What did become evident was that many people equate the European Union in Brussels with the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg. You know the statement; we've heard many of our independence supporting friends use it: "I want independence, BUT I'm not sure about Europe!".
This is EXACTLY what Westminster wants you to do.
Mr.Cameron has promised some sort of "In/Out" referendum in regards to Europe in 2015. However, there is a confusion out there about what "Europe", and "which" Europe he may mean. They (Westminster) seem to mix the ECHR and the European Union in one sentence. To my mind they are attempting, and in many instances succeeding, to make them appear to be the one and the same organisation.
Therefore will this vote in 2015 may be just a vote to remove the UK (or rUK) from the economic organisation of the EU, or will they confuse things further by including self removal from the ECHR? And once we (or rUK) choose to remove ourselves - what will be next on the rather strange agenda of Westminster? I'm not going say this is just a Conservative Party issue, as Labour aren't exactly making the kind of reassuring noises or clarifying this issue, as one would hope under the circumstances.
The European Union and the European Court of Human Rights, they're just the same, aren't they? They're both in Europe, they both affect and meddle in what happens in the UK, right?
Well, no; neither body has a lot to do with the other - in the way Westminster want you to believe, anyway.
The Court of Human Rights began its life under the Council of Europe in 1959; the Council of Europe [1] being founded by the Treaty of London in 1949, and signed by the United Kingdom and 9 other states.
This isn't some fang-dangle invention of Brussels. This was something which was born of World War II. Even Churchill mooted a "United States of Europe" as far back as 1946, and during a radio broadcast in 1943, he mentioned a Council of Europe.
Well, no; neither body has a lot to do with the other - in the way Westminster want you to believe, anyway.
The Court of Human Rights began its life under the Council of Europe in 1959; the Council of Europe [1] being founded by the Treaty of London in 1949, and signed by the United Kingdom and 9 other states.
This isn't some fang-dangle invention of Brussels. This was something which was born of World War II. Even Churchill mooted a "United States of Europe" as far back as 1946, and during a radio broadcast in 1943, he mentioned a Council of Europe.
The birth of the European Union was in 1957 with the Treaty of Rome [2]. It was from this basis the economic union of European nations grew, and to which Britain became a fully signed-up member in 1973 [3]. What isn't clear in all this, is even "Europe", governed from Brussels, has to be held accountable to the human rights standards set in Strasbourg. Otherwise it would be case of the tail wagging the dog.
The need for Westminster to induce public confusion with these two organisations is very clear. This is all to do with stripping you of your human rights. And it will be done using lies, confabulation, sleight of hand and down-right bovine effluent.
The need for Westminster to induce public confusion with these two organisations is very clear. This is all to do with stripping you of your human rights. And it will be done using lies, confabulation, sleight of hand and down-right bovine effluent.
"But!" - I hear you cry, "Europe is interfering with everything, just look at that Abu Qatada!" Well, what about him? Everyone of us is entitled to human rights, are we not? It may well have worked fine for Mr Qatada, but it certainly didn't work for Saddam Hussein who appealed frantically to the ECHR to prevent the coalition troops from handing him over to the Iraqi interim government, stating he feared he would be executed [4].
You also have to recognise just how much the ECHR interferes with legal decisions made in Britain. Westminster wants you to think that UK courts can't take a breath without some European judge jumping on their backs. This is not so. The UK lost only 10 cases last year [5].
Westminster needs this confusion to continue in order for people to VOLUNTARILY give up their human rights. And once forfeited how would we ever get them back?
We can look on in horror just now as the rights of vulnerable, sick and disabled people are eroded by the changes in benefit entitlements, and currently there may be ways of dealing with this with help from Europe. There may even be ways of dealing with the fact that Westminster is trying very hard to introduce a law which can be retroactively applied [6]. Something that could never happen if it were included in a written constitution, similar to the USA.
A retroactive law could seem "benign". For instance, a local authority could decide to make a place that was free and legal to park illegal - and backdating it however long. You could, conceivably, receive a parking ticket for leaving your car there one day 3 months ago - when it was legal. Nice little income generator, but what if it were to be applied to other, more sinister areas? What if a government decides to increase income tax - then backdate to last year? Where would it end?
This situation of confusion over what constitutes Europe affects those uncertain voters in the independence referendum. It must be clear that the human rights issue is separate from the European membership issue.
We need to be sure of what we are demanding from our political representatives.
If we're not, it might just come back and bite us hard - in a Room 101 near you [7]
Further Reading: